RADIOMarch 29, 2024

How a Baptist Pastor Went from Shroud of Turin SKEPTIC to DEFENDER

Is there enough evidence to prove that the Shroud of Turin is real? Prestonwood Baptist Church apologetics pastor Jeremiah Johnston used to be a skeptic. But once he did a deep dive into the history of the Shroud, he became a “total defender” of the Shroud’s authenticity. This Easter Week, Pastor Johnston joins the Glenn Beck Program to lay it all out from a scientific perspective. Plus, he explains why you don’t need to be Catholic to believe the Shroud is truly the burial cloth of Jesus Christ.

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: Yesterday, we had Jeremiah J. Johnston on. He was the author of a book, called Body of Proof. He has his doctorate. But so do I.

I know I'm a doctor of humanities. And I didn't even study for the test. But he's also the president of Christian thinker society, Prestonwood Baptist Church, and we were talking yesterday about the Shroud of Turin, which surprised me. Because a lot of people, especially in the south Baptist, and even evangelicals. They don't necessarily hold to the traditions of the Catholic Church. And I -- I think we all have unbelievable pieces of the puzzle, and one of those pieces, I think as -- is the Shroud of Turin. And I didn't know what to think about it, until a few years ago. He's writing a whole book on the Shroud of Turin. So we thought we would bring him back today. This is the burial cloth of Jesus Christ, that's what it's purported to be. The burial cloth. And it is a -- a reverse negative. It is almost like when his body came back to life. This is the way I view it.

When his body came back to life. It's like the burial cloth was like a film. And it printed in a burst of light. It printed the negative of his body in that cloth.

And nobody really knows how it was made, if it was fake. Jeremiah, welcome to the program.

JEREMIAH: Glenn, it's great to be back with you. And I'm sure we have people that right now, that are like Thomas Didymus. Remember Thomas the twin, that he said in John 20:25, hey, look, you can say Jesus is God. Good for you. But unless I see his nail-scarred hands. Unless I can put my hand in his side, I won't believe. Well, guess what we're going to do on the Glenn Beck Program? You'll actually be able to see the nail-pierced hand of Jesus, thanks be to the Shroud of Turin.

GLENN: Okay. Explain the history of the Shroud of Turin. Of where it came from. Of when we think it first appeared.

JEREMIAH: Absolutely. And let's make sure we situate this. Because you bring up a really important point. There's been a pejorative vibe towards the shroud, by anyone who isn't Catholic. I want to remind our audience, the Catholic Church, they're the largest landowners on church. Did you know that? They actually have a lot of land. They have a lot of assets and property. And guess what, it turns out they have some excellent artifacts for the Christian faith. C.S. Lewis. We've all heard of C.S. Lewis. I love Lewis. I lived in Oxford for three years. Glenn, I didn't know it until this year. Jack Graham, my pastor and I, went to Oxford on an inspirational summer trip, and then we went and did some golfing at St. Andrews. We literally went to Lewis' home, and I look up on Lewis' home. I don't know if you can see this, but for the benefit of our audience, I'm holding it right up to my face. I look up, C.S. Lewis kept a picture of the Shroud of Turin in his bedroom, next to his bed, where he slept. And the reason he did that, Lewis said, I needed a reminder every morning and every evening, that my God has a face. And so we're not talking about something weird or frisure, even C.S. Lewis took it seriously.

GLENN: So when did it first appear on the scene?

JEREMIAH: This is what's remarkable out of the Shroud of Turin, goes back far beyond the radio carbon dating. And as you point -- because some people hear shroud, they're like, what is that? As you pointed out, this is a burial garment for Jesus. All four gospels say that Joseph of Arimathea, and Nicodemus, two members of the Sanhedrin. Remember, if the Sanhedrin condemned a criminal to death, it was according to the Mishna. The Sanhedrin had to bury the condemned criminal. What do we see in the juridical procedure of Jesus?

Two members. Joseph of Arimathaea, and Nicodemus. They take Jesus, and they wrap his body in a burial garment. And they bury him in Joseph of Arimathaea's tomb.

GLENN: And it's not like when you think of wrapping a body. You think of like a mummy. But this is actually like a very long tablecloth, very, very long.

JEREMIAH: Right.

GLENN: And it's -- they laid it down, then put the body in. And then where the head is, they took and they pulled the rest of the fabric down to his feet. So it's a double image of the back, then a space, then the front of this body.

JEREMIAH: Exactly. Exactly. And that is not unusual. If you were in the Jewish burial traditions, you would do that. You might say, oh, Glenn. Jeremiah. There's no way that a burial shroud could last for 2,000 years. Give me a break. Well, actually, when you're a student of history, you can see, we even have a Tarkan dress linen shirt, and guess what, Glenn. It's 3,000, 200 years older than the Shroud of Turin. It's 5,000 years old.

So given the right set of circumstances, linen will last forever. So you're exactly right. It's 14 feet long. It's about 4 feet wide. Longer than our studio table here at Mercury Studios. And what's fascinating is, something occurred. And I have the top five reasons why I went from skeptic. Glenn, I was a total skeptic, until I went and wrote Body of Proof.

Did the video series for the Bible study, Body of Proof in Jerusalem. Went to the shroud exhibit, had private access.

Exhibited all -- looked at all the artifacts. And then I came out with top five reasons, that utterly took me from skeptic to total defender now of the shroud.

GLENN: Okay. So let's share those.

JEREMIAH: Number five. Let's do a countdown. You like countdowns, Glenn?

GLENN: Sure.

JEREMIAH: The Shroud of Turin is the most studied artifact of the archeological world, there's not a close second. And the second thing I want to say, is it's almost the most lied about artifact in the archaeologically world.

GLENN: Okay. Wait. Let's start with the first one. Which is the most studied. How do you know that, and what's been done with it?

JEREMIAH: Because I've read all the peer-reviewed journals that you don't have to, Glenn.

GLENN: Go ahead.

JEREMIAH: There's been an amazing evidential history of the Shroud of Turin. In 1978, the Sturkin (phonetic), this is the Shroud of Turin research project team. Went to Italy. They thought it would be a free trip to Italy. They were all having drinks in the lobby of the hotel. Giggling that the on the Catholic Church's dime, they would have a free trip to Italy. They only had two days to prove that it was a hoax. And guess what, nobody was giggling two days later. They had approximately a hundred twenty hours to examine this very ancient shroud, which has a very unique history.

I mean, Hitler tried to steal it. They had to save it from Hitler's hands during World War II. The history of the shroud is just remarkable. So these were not Bible scholars. These were not -- as far as I know, they were outside of the priests, that were kind of security overlooking the shroud, while it was being looked at.

These were all weapons scientists. Barry Schwartz, who you interview, that I encourage everybody to go back and watch the Glenn Beck interview with Barry Schwartz. He was a nominal Jew. His only bias was, he thought it was a hoax and a joke when he went there. And now he's utterly convinced, that it's not only not a hoax. Because as we'll talk about in a minute, you cannot -- if it's a hoax, it's never been repeated. He's convinced that it's an authentic burial shroud of Jesus, so it's the most studied cross-disciplinary practice in the world.

GLENN: And the -- in 19 -- the 1970s, when Barry was part of this. As you said, they all went in as skeptics.

And I believe it came out, at the time, that it was possible. But radio carbon data was saying, no. It's like a thousand years later. Or something.

But something was wrong. And I don't remember what it was. Maybe you do.

Barry said, it was only until later, when technology changed.

JEREMIAH: Right. Right.

GLENN: That they realized, oh, my gosh, this is that old.

JEREMIAH: Yeah. And 1978, you have the original research project. And they come out. What they say, it's not a hoax. There's no pigment. There's no ink. There's no dye. The shroud has survived three fires. It's been doused in water twice. If there was dye, if there was paint, it would have bled out. It would have smeared. Essentially, they came out and said, it's not a hoax. We don't know what it is. Ten years later, 1988. This is point number three in the countdown, which we'll get to. The 1988 carbon dating was done. So about ten years after that original research project.

GLENN: Okay. All right.

JEREMIAH: And this is when all the headlines came out, Glenn, that said, this is a total hoax. The carbon 14 dating -- dated it to the late 13th, early 14th century. There's huge problems with that, and we'll discuss that.

GLENN: Okay. So number four.

JEREMIAH: Number four. Science today.

This is what really arrests my attention. Cannot explain how the image is in the cloth.

Now, Glenn, you've seen the shroud.

I mean, it's stunning.

The energy it would have taken.

GLENN: I never actually -- I never actually have seen it in person.

I was going to go to Turin. I wanted to go this summer to Turin, just to see it. Because talking to Barry Schwartz has totally changed my mind on it. You can't see it. Because it's protected.

JEREMIAH: It's under a vault. They bring it out every few years. It's that same John the Baptist Cathedral in the Piedmont District of Northern Italy, as you say in Turin, Italy. By the way, if you go to Jerusalem, there's an incredible Shroud exhibit there that shows every aspect of the Shroud.

And I'm talking not just scientists in general. Rocket scientists. Republican scientists.
Chemical scientists. Cannot explain how the image is in the Shroud.

If it was a forgery, if it was a hoax, it's never been able to be repeated.

I mean, this is unbelievable. These aren't Bible theologians or commentators saying it. They're scientists saying, we cannot explain how there's an image. And here's the fascinating thing, Glenn. Do you know if you get closer than 8 feet, the image vanishes. You actually have to stand back from it, 8 feet, to be able to see the image.

It's very unique.

Will Trump’s Release of MLK & JFK Files Reveal the DARK TRUTH

President Trump has ordered officials to start the process of releasing the JFK, RFK, and MLK Jr. files. But the family of MLK has requested the opportunity to review the files before their release. What dark secrets may be hidden in them? Glenn and Stu review the rumors that the files may contain proof that MLK had affairs with 40 different women, among other heinous acts. But would this destroy his legacy and message of unity? Glenn and Stu also review JFK’s grandson’s response to Trump’s plan and why Glenn believes the truth MUST come out.

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: Big weekend this weekend. All right, we will talk about -- let's talk about what's happening in Washington, DC. The Martin Luther King family has reacted to Trump's executive order. And as has the JFK family.

They both say, this is a political stunt. I don't know how it's a political stunt. It was supposed to come out in 2027.

No. It was supposed to come out, when?

In the teens. Twenty teens? And then it kept getting delayed. Delayed. Then Donald Trump delayed it last term. Joe Biden, I -- he might have thought he was JFK for a while.

I'm not really sure.

Or Martin Luther King. And then it's come up again.

And people are tired of secrets.

And so Donald Trump said he would start releasing some of the secrets, that should be released.

And a few of those are the RFK files.

The JFK files.

And the MLK files. So hmm. What do they say?

Well, the Martin Luther King family, they would like to see everything first.

I don't know if you get that privilege. But okay.

Why?

Oh. Do you happen to remember what was said about these files last time.

Last time, they were about to come out.

The guy who is the Martin Luther King authorized biographer, has come out and said, really bad things are in this file.

We all know that he was a philanderer.

And I have to tell you, as I get older, I have more to do for people who did amazing things.

Because I don't -- perfect people aren't the ones that usually stand up and say, I'm going to risk my life for that cause.

Perfect people are usually the ones that are like, no, I've got way too much to lose here.

Martin Luther King was not the first guy that was approached to lead this movement. Just like Rosa Parks wasn't the first one approached on the bus. The first one was too flawed.

She was a teenager that was pregnant, and they didn't think she would garner enough sympathy. The other pastors that were approached to lead this movement all said, no, I've got way too much to lose.

No. They knew what it meant! Martin Luther King was the first one that stood up. And I think the same could be said about Donald Trump. He's not a perfect guy. But he's the first one that would say, yeah. I'll risk my life for it.

I'll do it. I'll stand.

I mean, who else gets up from an assassination, and looks at the crowd, and says, fight!

That's pretty amazing.

So they're not perfect people.

But Martin Luther King, you know, we know he was unfaithful, but apparently what is in this file, is really not good.

STU: Yeah. That's one way to state it. Uh-huh.

GLENN: First, it looks like there's an FBI letter that was trying to blackmail Martin Luther King. So something bad on the government. Trying to blackmail him. Saying, basically kill yourself or this is coming out.

But then there is information on intimate relationships with at least three women. One in Atlanta. One in Mount Vernon. One in New York. One in Washington, DC.

Another memo refers to a recording where King looked at -- this is according to his biographer, where King quoting looking on and laughed as the pastor of Baltimore's Cornerstone Baptist church allegedly raped a woman in the Willard Hotel.

Now, that pastor died in 1991. So there's no way to verify the FBI's information. It's not clear whether the agents involved were transcribing the true reality of his private life, or creating gossip. We don't know. But --

STU: They did, obviously, try to hurt him. And his reputation. That's kind of known. And it's been known for a long time. The question is, is this stuff true? As you point out, the guy who came out with this information in 2019, I think it was, is a very reputable guy. Pulitzer Prize-winning biographer. Right?

GLENN: Again, and authorized by the King family. So this is the guy the King family has said is credible.

STU: And it's hard to believe this lands in any other place than them saying, well, the government did this. And, you know, they will deny it, I think.

GLENN: Well, and does a tape exist? The letter is 500 words. Claims to be from an African-American who supported the civil rights movement.

It was, however, written by the FBI. It accuses King of immoral conduct lower than that of a beast. I'm quoting. And a giant liability to all of us Negroes. Quoting.

STU: Yeah. You didn't have to tell that was a quote.

GLENN: Well, I wanted to make sure.

STU: Unless I don't know something about your background. I don't know.

GLENN: It encourages King to listen to an endorsed -- an enclosed tape, so we don't know if the tape exists.

The writer tells King, it's all there on the record. Your sexual orgies. Listen to yourself, you filthy abnormal animal. You are on record. You have been on record, all of your adulteress acts. Sexual orgies, extending far into the past. But this someone, but a tiny sample. You have 34 days in which to do, dot, dot, dot. There is only one way out for you. You better take it before your filthy, fraudulent self is bared before the nation.

I mean, it's not going to make the FBI look good. And it may not make Martin Luther King look good.

STU: The other one you mentioned too, was affairs, which are well-known.

The buyer first says, it's been well-known for 35 to 40 years, that there have been multiple other girlfriends.

I always thought that there were probably ten or 12 over the course of four to five years. This new material makes clear that the total is more like 40 to 45.

GLENN: Wow.

STU: I mean, that's getting a lot of work there. You're a busy bee. Forty to 45, plus the civil rights thing. That's a busy schedule.

GLENN: When do you have time to eat?

STU: Right!

GLENN: The 32-year-old grandson of JFK made an announcement yesterday about JFK's assassination file being opened.

He said, that this is nothing more than a grand scheme. Let's see here.

STU: Grand scheme?

GLENN: Yeah. He said, there is no grand scheme to kill the president. Or, JFK.

And this scheme is just being a political prop, using John F. Kennedy as a political prop for Trump.

STU: How? Why?

GLENN: I don't know. I have no idea.

STU: It's hard to even understand the -- look, why would you not want to know this? What year is this? It's 2025. This happened a long time ago. It's about time we know what actually went on there.

And, look, there will be, I'm sure, some bad things. Some things that probably look for these guys. And some that look bad.

GLENN: Who cares?

STU: They're historical figures.

GLENN: We just want the true history. That's all I want. That's all I want.

STU: We already did a movie about it. It's time to find out what's going on.

GLENN: Yeah. And if you want the country to survive, we have to transparent. I want to know all the things. Even if everybody was pardoned. I want to know who was involved in the January 6th thing. I want to know all the facts.

STU: True.

GLENN: Even if we can't put everybody in jail, I want to know all the facts on -- on the Russia, Russia, Russia thing. On the Joe Biden, you know -- we have to expose these things.

STU: I want to know who hid and how they hid Joe Biden's mental time line from the American people.

GLENN: Big time.

STU: I want to know that. I want an investigation on that.

GLENN: Those people -- those people should go to jail, because I don't think they've been pardoned.

STU: That's true. Exactly.

It needs to be investigated. We need to know how far that went. This is one of the reasons, it feels like to me, hearing you over the years, that you put together the museum.

To unearth things like this. Good or bad, either way, the American people deserve to know the truth.

GLENN: Hello! You have to know the truth, and especially the dark sides of ourselves.
Otherwise, there's bitter and sweet. I mean, I will talk to you a little bit about AI, and AI is offering us a perfect world. Okay?

That's what this is going to be, a perfect life.

STU: Hmm.

GLENN: The Garden of Eden. It already existed. Okay?

And we gave it up, for knowledge. Of good and evil.

There is oppose to everything. Good, evil, pleasure, pain. All of that.

And you have to have both sides.

Otherwise, you don't know really what you have.

So right now, Americans haven't seen a lot of pain in our lives. I mean, whatever you're going through, might seem like a lot of pain. But as a country, nothing like the Great Depression.

Nothing like World War II. We haven't experienced that. So we don't really appreciate what we have.

We have to know both sides. And, you know, when it comes to Martin Luther King, that's a holiday.

We took away the Abraham Lincoln holiday. And the George Washington holiday. To make it, a combined holiday for presidents, which presidents?

And then gave Martin Luther King his holiday.

Okay. Was that right? Was that a mistake?

I don't know. Let's just know who we're holding up here. And that doesn't mean that his ideas of America live up to your promises as important. It's probably more important now than ever before. Because the people who have been oppressed in the past, are being convinced that you're still oppressed, and now the only way to not be oppressed is to take Martin Luther King's message, and flip it upside, on its head.

And say, you've got to be a racist to be an antiracist. The only way to fix racism is to engage in racism. These are important conversations for us to have.

And I for one, applaud the president for doing this. And I think we should get all of it. Absolutely all of it. And I hope it doesn't stop here.

The REAL Reason Trump Wants Greenland and the Panama Canal | Glenn TV | Ep 407

Glenn Beck debunks the hysterical claims that President Trump wants to conduct military invasions because of his interests in Greenland and the Panama Canal. His critics ignore the big picture. This isn’t some imperialistic power play — it is strategic maneuvering to counter Chinese and Russian ambitions. The U.S. has a long history of planting a flag in Greenland to combat threats from Nazis and the Soviet Union. Greenland also has some of the world’s largest untapped deposits of rare earth minerals, including graphite, copper, and lithium, that are essential for making all kinds of tech, vehicles, and planes. Glenn argues that it’s in our national security interest to collapse China’s stranglehold on mining and refining the world’s rare earth minerals. Trump’s critics also forget the history of the Panama Canal. Ronald Reagan reminded us in 1976: “We bought it. We paid for it.” So why shouldn’t we keep it? The U.S. is still the number one customer of the Canal, but China is number two. President Trump knows the canal is a chokepoint for our economy and fired a warning shot at China in his inaugural address. At the end of the day, the two places are high stakes real estate deals, and who better to negotiate those deals than our new 47th president?

How to Expose WOLVES in the Second Trump Era | Glenn Beck at TPUSA’s AmFest 2024

Donald Trump has returned as the 47th President of the United States of America. But the fight to make America free again has just begun. Speaking at Turning Point USA’s 2024 AmericaFest, Glenn Beck highlights a million ways the country could tear itself apart and the ONE way it can stay together. Glenn heads to the chalkboard to explain how to figure out who’s really on Team Truth and who’s a wolf in sheep’s clothing. Plus, he breaks out plenty of historical artifacts that help tell the story: Darth Vader’s helmet, a cup from the Mayflower, a “Batman Begins” cowl, the Holy Grail from “Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade,” and more …

Illegal Immigrants FLEE America as Trump Deportations Begin

President Trump’s mass deportation operation has begun and reports are already coming out that illegal immigrants are voluntarily deporting themselves! But the legacy media is in full panic mode, insisting that Americans should shed tears as Trump and the military rip children from their mothers. But is that actually what he’ll do? Glenn and Stu review what Trump’s real plan is. Plus, Glenn has a message for “sanctuary cities” like Chicago: “You’re only getting more people deported quicker.”

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: Oh, boy. Stu, Al Sharpton is very upset. Very upset today.

STU: Oh, no.

GLENN: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He is very upset that companies are dropping the enforcement of diversity, equity, and inclusion policies. He said, why did we have DEI? We have DEI because you have denied us diversity. You denied us equity. You denied us inclusion.

If you want to put us in the back of the bus, we're going to do the Dr. King/Rosa Parks on you. I don't know if that's a new dance move or what.

STU: It's a TikTok dance.

GLENN: It's a TikTok dance. But, you know what, I really don't fear Al Sharpton.

STU: No?

GLENN: You know, used to be a fear of Al Sharpton with some. And no.

I don't think -- you watch how insignificant that is going to be.

Americans have heard it all. They've done it all.

They're not afraid of it anymore. Oh, my gosh. They're marching in front of us. Calling us racist.

Oh, my gosh.

Well, let's give them a little something to make them go away. They don't go away. Okay?

They don't go away!

You hire, and you take activists, bringing them into your company. Or you play ball with those activists.

Revolutionaries. That's all you're going to have left in the end. So congratulations with that. Saw that. It doesn't work.

No interest. It's not going to make a difference.

STU: It's a mindset change. You know.

GLENN: It is. It is.

STU: I remember the first time we got protested by one of these organizations.

And it was like, gosh, what's happening.

Wait a minute.

I didn't understand it. We came from a -- we started a local radio show, that wound up going national.

When you get to that level. These things start happening. And then like, I don't know. A few times after it occurs.

GLENN: You roll your eyes.

STU: You roll your eyes. When I go on Twitter. And you see something negative about you or whatever.

You just don't -- generally speaking, you just don't care.

It comes and goes. You just get to that point, none of it makes any difference to you. It becomes a superpower.

Because you just don't care about any of it.

GLENN: And especially now, nobody cares about it. Nobody cares about it. You know, do you mind being called -- now people are wearing that as a badge of honor.

Oh, Al Sharpton. Yeah. He came after me because I believed in actual diversity. Because I believed in actual racism. Was bad. I believed in that idea, and the best way to fight it, is to forget about color. And to just look for merit.

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I'm scared. It's not going to change anything.

Let me give you a couple of other things that Donald Trump -- in fact, I could go a full hour of the stuff just remaining in the last two hours, of the things he's done in the last 24.

President Donald Trump declared the global corporate minimum tax. Did you know we had one?

Yeah.

The Biden administration signed us up for this one.

A global minimal tax.

So, in other words, companies we promised. We promised the whole world, we're never going to have a tax rate lower than 15 percent.

The global minimum tax. Because that would be unfair. And Donald Trump said, yeah, screw you. We're not doing that. And let everyone know, that uh-uh. No. We're not going to do that.

Now, that doesn't mean we will have a tax lower than 15 percent.

STU: Let's do it! Let's embrace it.

GLENN: I would love it.

STU: I will say, when it comes to economic competition. I want to be unfair. I want to be the country, where everyone else is like, gosh, I've got to get there.

How do we get involved with them? That's exactly who I want to be. Not to mention, it really benefits the people here in the United States, more than all.

GLENN: Yeah. Now, not everybody agreed to it.

Because after Biden agreed to it, the pillar one talks. That should really scare you.

This is pillar one. The pillar one talks stalled. Because we just kind of lost interest, I guess.

Countries, Italy, France, UK. Turkey.

Weren't really excited about reinstating their digital taxes. And now with Donald Trump in, there's no way they will do it.

So congratulations to the rest of the world. We have helped set you free, again!

Now, Rand Paul has introduced some legislation to repeal Corporate Transparency Act.

This is so important. The CTA. Corporate Transparency Act.

We talked about this. This is -- this will protect small businesses, and it was signed into law as part of fiscal year 2021, the National Defense Authorization Act. What does this have to do with national defense?

It requires individuals with an ownership interest in a limited liability company. An LLC, to disclose all their personal information to the US Treasury Department's financial crimes enforcement network.

And they go after American small business owners. And any failure to comply could result in up to two years, in prison and up to $10,000 per violation.

So they are repealing that, or at least that has been introduced. Because, you know, farmers, restaurants, gyms.

Lawn service companies. All of these people -- what? I have to -- I have to register with the Treasury Department's Financial Crimes Unit. I don't think so. No.

STU: That's a big one. We talked a lot. That one when it happened.

GLENN: That's a big, big, big one.

STU: Pain. Giant pain at the very least going away, hopefully.

GLENN: Yes. Also, an update on the border. The Southern Border, apparently, witnessed an outflow of persons, that came into the United States over the last four years.

I don't -- I don't know if you heard that.

There was an outflow of persons. Even on inauguration day.

Illegal aliens were voluntarily deporting themselves.

And saying, I --

STU: Yeah. You know, that's -- good! First of all.

That's -- if you're illegally, you should leave. You should leave. And you should leave on your own.

It's interesting.

There's a poll Axios had today.

Which is, the share of Americans who agree with immigration policies, like deporting immigrants, who are in the country illegally.

The number overall, 66 percent. So a popular -- a popular policy.

GLENN: Uh-huh. Uh-huh.

STU: But they -- the take from Axios is, they don't agree with the ways to do it.

Right? And so they say, here are their examples of this.

Using active duty military to find undocumented immigrants.

Only let's say 38 percent agree with that.

Deporting immigrants that came to the US illegally as children, 34 percent agree.

Quickly deporting detained immigrants, even if it involves separating families or sending people to countries, other than their country of origin, 34 percent.

Using money allocated to pay for the US military for deportation, 28 percent.

Deporting immigrants who are in the country legally, 11 percent.

Who the hell is talking about deporting people in the country legally?

GLENN: And who is 27 percent or 25 percent for that?

STU: Yeah, it was 11 percent.

Now --

GLENN: Very well. Eleven.

STU: Right. But are any of those -- any of those policies really the policies you're talking about on a day-to-day basis? There are waves of this, right?

It starts with, obviously, criminals. That have committed other crimes. Then you have people who come in contact, with law enforcement for other things that they may have done. If you are busted. Let's say in a -- a raid of a factory.

GLENN: Uh-huh.

STU: Those people would get deported now. As opposed to released and they would go to another factory.

Those types of things are the interactions that would lead to a deportation.

Like, they are trying to paint this picture. I heard all sorts of coverage on this, this morning. Like, we're going to have military members, going school to school, to find children, who are illegal immigrants and deport them.

GLENN: It's ridiculous.

STU: That's not what these policies are going to do.

And what more likely, the overwhelming majority of these, quote, unquote, deportations are going to be of the self-deportation variety.

When people start seeing that, hey. I got pulled over for, you know -- because I got in a car accident. Or whatever.

And, you know, the police came over. And they investigated. Found out, somehow, we're illegal immigrants.

You will get deported for something like that. People start seeing that.

They will be like, wait a minute. There's no longer this giant welcome mat. For us to come here illegally.

And that message --

GLENN: Right. It will be too much stress on the family. Too much.

And they will say, what will we do with the children? Take them back home with you. Yeah, what is wrong with you?

STU: You shouldn't just leave them here. What do you do, when you leave a park? You don't just leave them at the park. You take them with you.

GLENN: What do I do with children, when I take them to the park?

STU: You take them home with you.

And that is what a large portion of this, will be people saying. You know, and when we talk about this.

They say, oh, they're coming here to do jobs. And Americans won't do.

When we say those jobs aren't here.

They're not going to come. Right?

When we're not rewarding companies for giving jobs to illegal immigrants. Who are paying them less than the minimum wage.

GLENN: The majority of people are going to self-deport.

Also, the cities that are sanctuary cities are only making it worse. Because if they won't turn over the criminals. When they're released. Or they're in jail.

If they won't do that, then they release them. And our -- ICE needs to go find them.

And if they're hiding with the family and stuff like that or a different family, when we do find them, they'll bust everybody. They'll bust everybody.

So, you know, any sanctuary city that is saying, we're not going to help ICE. You're only helping more people get deported quicker.

And you're not really helping. Now, let me give you this from the Chicago Tribune.

When reports surfaced over the weekend, that mass deportations could potentially begin on the Chicago area on Tuesday.

Martin Ramos informed his boss he was taking time off from work. He stocked up on groceries and decided his kids would skip soccer practice this week.

Ramos, who immigrated from Guadalajara Mexico, without the necessary work permits, spent the first full day of Donald Trump's second presidency hunkered down with his family, trying to avoid being picked up by ICE agents.

An arrest, he knows, would destroy everything that he and his wife have worked for, and force their two boys into an uncertain future.

Force their two boys into an uncertain future. They're staying home from school because they play soccer. And they can't play soccer. We have to do everything possible to keep our children safe.

What will they do, if we get deported?
They will go home, with you!

ICE agents did not show up at the Juliet Factory where Ramos and his wife both work on Tuesday. But fear inflicted upon the employees there was evident.

A coworker told Ramos that only ten out of the typical 40 to 50 coworkers showed up.

In Little Village, one of Chicago's largest Mexican immigrant communities, streets were mostly deserted and quiet. Tamale vendors, a hardy group used to braving all kinds of weather, weren't lined up on the sidewalks.

The hardware store parking lots, where day laborers searched for work, were also largely empty.

So, in other words, they aren't hanging out with a sign that says, we'll work for food. We'll work for anything.

And picked up by construction workers that don't want to pay union workers in Chicago. Is that what I'm hearing from the Chicago Tribune?

The possibility of mass deportations have terrified some of the area's roughly 400,000 undocumented immigrants. Prompting many to skip work.

Keep their kids out of school. And stay hidden until the promised raids end.

They are not going to end. They are not going to end.

Now, Chicago is saying that they're not going to help at all.

That's okay.

That's okay.

Sunday mass at saint Agnes of Bohemia Catholic Church was unusually empty. And the church personally advised a group of street vendors, based on the southwest side to stay home during the week.

Until they will learn how ICE will operate. Out of the thirteen street vendors, only one was out there. Most vendors declined to speak to the Tribune out of fear, they might be identified and targeted.

People are hiding. They call me and ask me what to do. But my hands are tied. I don't think anyone knows what to do. Yeah. Here's what you do.

You tell them to go home!

You tell them that this government is serious about applying the laws, equally. And holding on to those laws.

And you then tell all minorities, in Chicago, you know, I've got to tell you, if your city continues to defy federal law, then your city is going to get funding, cut off from the federal government.

Let the minorities know that they are embraced bit federal government. But due to the city and the state's stance on protection of those who come here illegally and took your jobs and receive things the Democrats would have never given to you, or any other American.

The federal government only has one lever. And that is: To shut off the funding to Chicago.

So recognize who the bad guy here is. It's up to you, Chicago. It's up to you to stand up.

Now, the question is, are you going to stand up with illegals? Are you going to stand up for the absolute vast minority? Are you going to stand up against the minorities in your city, that are Americans?

Because they've been protesting this whole time, saying, wait.

Why are we getting the shaft, and these guys are getting hotel rooms, and free food, and everything else.

You never gave us any of that stuff.

Yeah. Well, it's time for Chicago to wake up. And these states will either be absolutely left behind, or they will wake up.

And that goes for California too. You are going to see that choice on Friday.